User:Katefan0/Talk1

Welcome!

Hello, and welcome to Wikipedia. Thank you for your contributions. I hope you like the place and decide to stay. Here are a few good links for newcomers:

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I hope you enjoy editing here and being a Wikipedian! By the way, you can sign your name on Talk and vote pages using three tildes, like this: ~~~. Four tildes (~~~~) produces your name and the current date. If you have any questions, see the help pages, add a question to the village pump or ask me on my Talk page. Again, welcome! -- Graham ☺ | Talk 19:03, 12 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Reply

I have replied to your comment on my talk page. →Raul654 08:10, Nov 13, 2004 (UTC)

New House members

Thanks for your message. No problem. The birth format I used automatically puts the name of the person into the category too (and a little thing like ensuring that "b" is lower case in "birth" is important, for some reason).

I think it's great that you're adding some political-issue background to the articles on the new members. It's exactly what we need. If you want to look at Jim Costa, you'll see an example of one article on a new House member I created - with a graphic at the bottom showing the former and current member of that district. Feel free to copy the HTML and adapt it if you want for your new articles. I also like adding the Congressional district number, but it's not necessary. Anyway, glad you're doing this! We'll get them done and in perfect shape long before the 109th Congress begins at this rate. Moncrief 19:09, Nov 13, 2004 (UTC)

Republican and Democrats

Since it looks like you can really help with adding some political information, I just want to say that instead of linking to Republican or Democrat (or even to Republican Party or Democratic Party), use the links to United States Republican Party and United States Democratic Party instead. Again, it's great to have you here. --Ricky81682 02:06, Nov 14, 2004 (UTC)

US Navy squadrons

I've made your start at a list of USN aircraft squadrons into a redirect. The reason is that I already created a much more comprehensive list a few months ago. However, if you want to look at my list and fill in any gaps you can see please do so. It's good to have another person around who is prepared to write articles that are often vital, but not the most interesting to create! David Newton 23:55, 18 Nov 2004 (UTC)

If you go to my user page you will see a whole load of links to lists of military units. It's not quite comprehensive but most of the major lists on the site are linked to there. The USAF squadron list could certainly do with some serious work. BTW, your article on VF-211 looks to be very good. I've created a redirect from VF-211 to the article. David Newton 00:21, 19 Nov 2004 (UTC)

The whole 109th Congress

Thanks for finishing up the profiles! I don't have time to do an exhaustive check that they're all done, but off the top of my head... I don't see anything on Connie Mack IV. Is it under a different name? If so or when done, also add a link to the disambiguation page Connie Mack (which now has listings for his great-grandfather and father, which of course shouldn't be changed). Thanks again. Moncrief 00:15, Nov 19, 2004 (UTC)

USN Squadrons

Hi Katefan0 - thanks for a couple of excellent contributions to a curiously overlooked area. If I can be so bold as to offer a couple of hints:

• Categories aren't like normal articles - they're more like a cataloguing system for articles. In general, they answer the question "This is an article about a..." (Answer: "United States Navy squadron" - but note that by convention, category names are pluralised). If you want to refer readers back to the main list of all US Navy squadrons, you should say "see also: List of United States Navy aircraft squadrons" at the end of your article.
• You'll find it useful to familiarise yourself with ship and aircraft naming conventions to make sure your links go where you want them to. This is easier to demonstrate than explain, so if you check out the edits I just made to the VFA-14 Tophatters article, you'll see what I mean. In general, link to US ships like this: [[USS Enterprise (CVN-65)|USS ''Enterprise'']] and to US aircraft like this: [[F4U Corsair]] when the aircraft has an official or widely-used name, and like this: [[Boeing C-22]] if it doesn't. Note that usually if you want to link from a specific variant, you'll need to use a "pipe trick" like this: [[F-4 Phantom II|F-4J Phantom II]] since few variants have specific articles written about them (yet). Full detail atWikipedia:Naming conventions (aircraft) and Wikipedia:Naming conventions (ships)
• Note that prior to 1962, the US Navy named aircraft by manufacturer, so Curtiss' first fighter was the FC, followed by the F2C, F3C etc. Subtypes were numbered with a dash, so F6C-1, F6C-2, F6C-3 etc.

Hope that isn't too much information overkill! Welcome to Wikipedia and keep up the great work! :) Cheers --Rlandmann 07:08, 19 Nov 2004 (UTC)

Charles Dent

Hi. I don't see an entry for the winner of the PA-15th District House seat? Am I missing it - is it under a variant name? Thanks. Moncrief 07:37, Dec 1, 2004 (UTC)

Never mind! I saw that it was under Charlie Dent and I did a redirect from Charles Dent. Does he usually go by Charlie then? Moncrief 07:43, Dec 1, 2004 (UTC)

Categorisation

Hi again - I'm just wondering whether piping the squadron articles to their nickname while categorising them is a good idea. Many (most?) squadrons don't seem to have had a nickname, and this means that eventually, the category will be a real mess, with some squadrons sorted under their nickname and some under their designation. The water gets further muddied under "V" (and eventually, "H"), as these letters will contain a mix of names and numbers. Just my 2c - and congratulations again for such nice work. --Rlandmann 22:31, 1 Dec 2004 (UTC)

The Humungous Image Tagging Project

Hi. You've helped with the Wikipedia:WikiProject Wiki Syntax, so I thought it worth alerting you to the latest and greatest of Wikipedia fixing project, User:Yann/Untagged Images, which is seeking to put copyright tags on all of the untagged images. There are probably, oh, thirty thousand or so to do (he said, reaching into the air for a large figure). But hey: they're images ... you'll get to see lots of random pretty pictures. That must be better than looking for at at and the the, non? You know you'll love it. best wishes --Tagishsimon (talk)

I just spotted your update to Uk-cumbria.png. Based on the list of tags, and the claim made by the uploader, shouldn't it be tagged as {{PD-USGov-CIA}} or {{PD-USGov-CIA-WF}} if it does come from the factbook? (I don't know if it does). Best to be as specific as possible! But kudos for actually doing the work. DavidBrooks 01:49, 9 Dec 2004 (UTC)

OK, you made a good point on my user page; it actually did get the permission from UT. DavidBrooks 01:53, 9 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Thanks for the story

Your story about your aunt brought tears to my eyes. It is all very real. We humans are just beginning to figure out how to be responsible for being here on this planet. :) Good to meet you. ---Rednblu | Talk 20:21, 12 Dec 2004 (UTC)

Philosophy of Mind Cleanup

Please explain this request on the philosophy of mind discussion page. 80.3.32.9 12:04, 18 Dec 2004 (UTC) I think I was pretty clear about why it needs cleanup on the cleanup page, but for the record, this is what I put on the page's discussion section: This article is written like an essay, not like an encyclopedia entry. Therefore, it needs cleanup. Katefan0 08:08, Dec 21, 2004 (UTC)

Texas Longhorn

You probably have this page on your watch-list, but just in case you do not, I added some more reference material on the talk page, as well as a suggestion on how to incorporate the various facts/views/theories on the downfall of the breed. I look forward to your feedback. Cheers, Johntex 00:48, 1 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Ah, leave it to someone who was on the TSP board to come behind me and fix my inconsistent University of Texas linking. Thanks! By the way, did you like how I improved the U of Michigan page? Hook 'em. Johntex 03:50, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Oops - sorry about the TSP bit. I thought I saw that on your User/Talk page but it was actually a post from Grouse, not you. I myself wrote many Firing Lines and a couple of editorials, and I wrote for the esSAy, which was the Student Government newsletter at the time - I don't know if they still have that. I feel your pain about the early hearing in the morning. I myself have slides to prepare for the board of directors meeting and instead I am on Wikipedia procrastinating picking up inspiration. Of course, you are 3 hours worse of then me if you are in D.C. Ah - the game! I could go on for a long, long time about how great that game was. For me, it was in the top 3 UT games; up there with beating U of H when they were really highly ranked (1988?) and beating Nebraska to win the first Big12 championship. An added bonus to the Michigan game was watching it with my good friend from the U of M. That accounts also for my being so extremely pleased with myself for editing the U of M page... Good luck with the early hearing. Johntex 04:12, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Preemptive VfDing

Hello Kate. As you may have noticed, I am preemptively posting my own articles to VfD, for example: THG and USA. I'm not doing this to prove or make a point, as Alkivar suggested, but simply to prevent myself from wasting time. As I'm sure you're aware, articles of great historical value are suggested for deletion daily, and on occassion the deletionists succeed in seeing these articles erased from Wikipedia. I'd much rather establish the retainability (avoiding the word "notability" here) up front or have my document killed from the get-go than spend a month writing, researching and referencing an article only to have it erased the moment I take a vacation from Wikipedia. P.S.: Which BBS did you used to run? —RaD Man (talk) 18:23, 4 Feb 2005 (UTC)

• It's an interesting strategy...... I think. What makes you think that they'd ever come up for VfD? Has someone attacked your articles in the past? (Head-scratching.) Of course, I have to point out that I myself am a deletionist. We're mostly good and thoughtful people, honest. On to the fun stuff -- My BBS was an upcoming 2-node run out of SoCal (LA) in the early 90's, running off Celerity (the programmer was a friend of mine), called Imperial City. You probably wouldn't recognize it unless you were active in SoCal. It had just started really taking off but I pulled the plug pretty soon after. TNSHB et al had gotten busted, and I was starting to be included in those gigantic conference phone calls the SoCal warez heavies would do all the time.. I guess about 6 mos later I took it down. I'd set up a panic button for my HD and was getting nervous everytime someone drove past the house too slow. Just wasn't worth it. I miss it sometimes though. I thought I'd had some ads saved on this computer, but I don't -- damn shame. Most of them were done for me by iCE though. Where were you active mostly? Katefan0 18:52, Feb 4, 2005 (UTC)
  • Yes. Articles for underground groups (warez included) old and new are constantly challenged on VfD. See: DEViANCE. My nominations are nothing more than refactored RickK quotes.  :) Celerity — I knew The Byter and even oversaw the design of several ANSI screens for The Lexicon of the Cabal and Celerity BBS during that time. Please tell him I said hello if you still keep in touch. Imperial City? Yes, it does sound vaguely familiar, there might even be a few ANSIs for it on the Dark Domain Archives DVD [1], who knows. I was active pretty much everywhere (literally), but live in Northern California. —RaD Man (talk) 19:10, 4 Feb 2005 (UTC)
    • Well, as far as VfD's go on those kinds of groups, you can count me an ally. One of Wikipedia's strengths, I think, is that it serves as a respository for underground and pop culture -- there've been several times when I've come here looking to understand some term or phenomenon and been rewarded. But there is a lot of crap that floats around in the stream, so to speak, that I am always ready to get rid of. Fancruft. Corporate drek. Isn't it funny what a small world it is?? Lexicon of the Cabal -- I haven't thought about this stuff for years and years. R. Bubba Magillicutty, Philosopher, Renegade Chemist, Dixie Flatline. You know Byter is still running around out there. I haven't emailed him in, God, probably a couple of years, I don't even remember what it is anymore, but he is still active on the MUD called Ancient Anguish, under his old handle. Whenever I have an urge that's usually how I get ahold of him. Also just read your iCE interview -- I knew Honus Wagner as well. I am from Houston originally and I started my first warez BBS there. Unfortunately I have no idea where he is these days -- we were never good friends but we were acquainted. Katefan0 19:29, Feb 4, 2005 (UTC)
      • Funny, I just went and poked around on textfiles.com and found a couple ACiD ads for my board -- one by Sonic and one by JED himself. I actually still have the computer my board ran on, with the entire BBS still intact. But it's down in Texas at the moment. Katefan0 21:10, Feb 4, 2005 (UTC)
        • Excellent. I thought it sounded familiar.  :) I work fairly closely with the maintainer of textfiles.com (you'll note that a large portion of artscene.textfiles.com is a derivative of an old archive called artpacks.acid.org which we hosted) and understand that he is looking towards archiving entire BBS setups some time in the not so distant future. I'd also be interested to know if you had any diskmags/ezines I am missing from the very early 1990s. You have a priceless time capsule on your hands, let me know if you ever have an opportunity to burn the files to some portable media (CD-R/DVD-R). —RaD Man (talk) 21:17, 4 Feb 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for editing repeated words

Thanks for your work at User:R3m0t/Reports. Ignoring the fact that Gmail addresses are now dirt cheap and available on Wikipedia, I can offer you up to 3 addresses as token of gratitude (and showing off that I have those invitations ;)) If you accept (reply on the reports page please), make sure that you are acceping e-mails from the left link "E-mail this user". r3m0t 22:02, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)

I replied at my own user page: User talk:R3m0t#Reports. r3m0t 22:36, 9 Feb 2005 (UTC)

DC

welcome to the dc-wikipedians club, hope everything is groovy with you. see you around. —thames 18:06, 11 Feb 2005 (UTC)

DC wikipedians club? neat, sign me up! ;) --Morbid-o 17:18, 25 Mar 2005 (UTC)

You were at the Texan?

Cool, what did you do? I love Jason but I'm not sure he really reached the bar for notability there...

And my feathers are never ruffled. --Grouse 01:01, 18 Feb 2005 (UTC)

• I wasn't at the Texan per se. I was one of those evil people on the TSP Board. Eeeeeeeeeevil. Well I'm told that's how we were portrayed downstairs. The year 2001 was not a banner year for boardroom-basement relations, but don't believe everything you hear. --Grouse 01:47, 19 Feb 2005 (UTC)
  • I'll tell if you tell. I'll even go first. Deal? ;) (Just so you know, I'm never anyone who ran for election to the editorship.) --Grouse 02:06, 20 Feb 2005 (UTC)
    • Changed my mind about what? Telling you who I am if you tell me? I was unclear that you had accepted that offer. ;) --Grouse 08:32, 28 Feb 2005 (UTC)
      • Oh right, I remember who you were. Jennie Kennedy told us you were going to write a story on the elected editor, but you were too busy and so Celina did it instead. Nice to see you again. ;) I'm Michael Hoffman, by the way, but you probably have no idea who I am. --Grouse 21:13, 28 Feb 2005 (UTC)
        • If there has ever been a finer example of damning with faint praise, I don't think I've seen it. But thanks anyway. ;) (yes, yes, I'm sure you didn't mean it that way, no need to say anything more etc etc) --Grouse 00:11, 2 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Return of the Untagged Image project

You were kind enough to contribute to the Wikipedia:Untagged images project; I beg to draw your attention to part 2 of the project - there are about 12,000 more images in need of tagging. Any assistance you could provide would be most welcome. thanks --Tagishsimon (talk)

Re: Katharine Hepburn

Hmm. I wasn't actually aware that particular "semi-policy" had much sway, but it does make sense. I sympathise with your quandary (it seems I reverted the same user back on January 3rd), but the fact that this user edits from an ever-shifting dynamic IP complicates any possible dispute resolution. However, I should point out that it does not appear as if you've been very close to violating the three revert rule; for that to happen, you'd have to revert the same page more than three times in the same 24-hour period. It's a small blessing that this user isn't very quick on the rebound, and seems to take at least a day or more to return.

For this dispute to be resolved amicably, a dialogue must be established: this does not seem likely to happen, as the user switches IPs after every edit (meaning messages on talk pages are very unlikely to be read). For this reason you have few options: you could start an RfC to attract more attention to the issue and more eyes watching for bad edits; and in the meantime, continue with a war of attrition and hope the user eventually tires of the issue.

If I see the user make unexplained deleterious edits again, I'll simply block the IP with a note to read his/her talk page, where I'll kindly ask the user to explain the reasons for his/her deletions on the article's talk page. Deleting material one doesn't agree with isn't strictly grounds for a block, but considering this user's track record—the first two pages of edit history at Katharine Hepburn are dominated by various reversions of his/her edits—I think a (temporary) block would be justified.

I hope the above was of some help. -- Hadal 02:27, 3 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Especially since the idiot edits from a variety of addresses, about the only thing you can do, short of the absolutely last step of protecting the page, is to keep it on your watchlist and keep checking on it. I've given up trying to deal with ISPs. They never reply. RickK 20:09, Mar 15, 2005 (UTC)

I couldn't write any more about Katharine Hepburn as a gay icon, because I was just merging from the now-deleted list in the Gay icon article to the gay icon category. Philwelch 22:58, 24 Mar 2005 (UTC)

Love Among the Ruins

Hi, and thanks for responding so quickly. I've already collected some material, so, if you don't mind, I'll just write it up and create the disambig page. Bye for now, <KF> 20:26, Mar 7, 2005 (UTC)

I was just going to answer "Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you." All you'll have to do is disambiguate the title on your own user page. <KF> 22:01, Mar 7, 2005 (UTC)

NAMBLA

Thanks for your offer of support. The most useful thing you can do is drop by regularly and revert the article to my most recent edit, so that I don't have to do it and get banned under the 3R rule. I see you are a political reporter. Perhaps you could contact someone in Boston (the court reporter on the Globe perhaps?) and find out (a) what has happened with the Curley v NAMBLA lawsuit mentioned in the article and (b) whether David Thorsdat and Daniel Thorstad are the same person or not. Adam 13:55, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Any info you can turn up by any method would be helpful. Adam 14:16, 9 Apr 2005 (UTC)

From a newbie who stumbled on this article via the village pump: Kudos on your excellent efforts in mediating the current controversies on the article and the talk page. Seeing stuff like this makes me want to stick around. Soundguy99 03:21, 16 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Your VFD vote on OurColony

I ask you to reconsider. Ourcolony was not created to circumvent the vote on OurColony.net but infact was created 2 days prior to your VfD submission. Check the history of the two sites and see for yourself.

Ourcolony history

-- Jonamerica 07:16 (UTC) on Monday, April 11 2005

OurColony

I can't understand your VfD police... nonsense and abusive. OurColony.net is a very interesting Xbox 360 marketing, like I Love Bees with high repercuss in media. [2] [3] --Mateusc 18:01, 13 Apr 2005 (UTC)

C'mon katefan. Give our wiki a chance. Maybe you should check it out? You obviously don't know what it's about. Therefore you are being quite naive about it's right to be allowed here. It's obviously not your thing. Just let us have a chance. lol that and the fact that deleting it would more than likely cause an anti-wikipedia campaign to start here and you'd have 100's per day starting new wiki's. Don't believe me? Read some of the forums. That's honestly not meant as a threat, only an insightful prediction. I've seen it before. We can stop the possiblity of that now. Just MHO --tcpvtec 20:35 14 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Help on NAMBLA Article

ALthough we haven't seen eye-to-eye on exactly everything, you are probably the most objective of all the participants in the current round of editing. Your contributions and insight are greatly appreciated, and your adherence to the highest standards of neutrality and quality of work are invaluable. Thank you for your time and effort, and I look forward to working with you in the future. Oh, and I think you deserve one of these Barnstars of Diligence. Sincerely, Corax 04:22, 16 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Gay Skinhead revision

As one who followed the VfD on Gay skinhead very closely, and who has at least heard of the book Gay Skins: Class, Masculinity, and Queer Appropriation, I'd especially appreciate any comments you might want to make on my rewrite. Thanks. Unconventional 08:51, 16 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Wikimeet

I was just looking at the new Cleanup Taskforce page, and noticed that you're in D.C. You might be interested attending the upcoming East Coast meetup in D.C.. Much fun shall be had by all. If you're interested and want any input into when we schedule it, go and register your availability. Happy editing, Isomorphic 01:43, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

No problem. Wikipedia is a deceptively large place, and it's easy to miss items of interest if you aren't looking at the right pages at the right time. Happens to me all the time. Hope we'll see you there. Isomorphic 04:47, 20 Apr 2005 (UTC)

The Humble Guys

No way, I'm way too young for that sort of thing. I didn't even know what the internet was in the early 90's! Thanks for the note, though. You learn something new every day. humblefool® 03:08, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

• You might want to leave a note for User:Kensuf and see if he replies.  ;) —RaD Man (talk) 03:11, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Cleanup Taskforce: Italian unification

Thanks, I'll take a look. --Tony Sidaway|Talk 05:54, 21 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Mateusc

I suggest you write an RfC on him. RickK 19:07, Apr 21, 2005 (UTC)

RfC is the first step for an RfA. You have to show that you've gone through all of the previous steps before the arbcomm will take an RfA. RickK 19:44, Apr 21, 2005 (UTC)

I should point out that I personally avoid the whole process, because I think it's too bureaucratic and it's broken, but it works for some people. RickK 19:51, Apr 21, 2005 (UTC)

High! Incidentally, what do I do right? MuppetMadness 01:54, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for your note!

I feel so honored! :) And I like to pet my cats too! (See now I read your page, spreading the joy). I'm glad you're helping out at the Cleanup Taskforce (I'm afraid to devote too much time, but I cleanup any errors I see usually.) --Dmcdevit 00:00, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Chiropractic medicine

So this is your revenge for Italian unification, huh? Actually I wanted to compliment you on the great work you're doing with that article—I'll recommend you to all my friends. I'll do my best with Chiropractic medicine although I know little about it—we discuss it briefly in medical school but studies supporting its efficacy have been rare. I'll look into it, though. — Knowledge Seeker দ 02:44, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC)

You're welcome! I never figured out precisely what he was trying to say. Anyway, I'm still trying to absorb Chiropractic medicine and read up a little on it; hoping to start editing this weekend. — Knowledge Seeker দ 18:27, 22 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Here's a Story I Will Tell, 'bout mah APPALACHIAN belle

I should have known. You fucking candel wanker.

Uhhh.... right. · Katefan0^(scribble) 14:47, Apr 22, 2005 (UTC)

I believe the accepted spelling is "candle." But you're not French--so you haven't read yer grammar books. AllenGinsberg 01:48, 3 May 2005 (UTC)

Buckshot

Ah, you're welcome. I was tracking him for a while -- almost seemed to be a wikianarchist. He was walking the line, pushing the bounds of acceptable behavior. When he finally stepped over the line (he hit a user page instead of a talk page), that was cause for a block. He's on my watchlist now, so we'll see. SWAdair | Talk 02:36, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Clean up of second industrial revolution

Hi Kate, I have had a quick look at this and there is not a lot wrong with it, though I quibble at the start date. Some sources I have here bring it back a couple of decades to the beginning of mass transportation with railways and steam-shipping. In fact it is linked to developments in science particularly relationg to industrial chemistry eg. dyestuffs and explosives and also electricity. I will aim to sort it out in a couple of days. Apwoolrich 07:22, 23 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for the doozy!! :)

The torture of a WikiJanitor never ends. LOL I've done some extensive work on 1921 in Germany. I need to rewrite and reorder a section or two but I think it looks much improved--Woohookitty 08:44, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Yes, I am a glutton for punishment...but WikiJanitor means glutton for punishment. :) --Woohookitty 22:00, 27 Apr 2005 (UTC)

DC Meetup will be May 7/8

The DC Meetup date has been finalized to May 7/8. Even if you can only come one of the days, that's still fine. Please watch this page for new details, which will be posted in the next couple days: Wikipedia:Meetup/Wikipedians of the East Coast field trip --brian0918&#153; 16:12, 24 Apr 2005 (UTC)

Warez thingy

Hi there! I noticed an old discussion between you and RAD on old warez groups and the like on Wikipedia. It is true that they tend to hit VfD for the simple reason that most people haven't heard of them - and it's somewhat difficult to distinguish an established 80's or 90's warez group from one of the gazillion 'we are s0 k3wl' websites of nowadays. Anyway what I'm getting at, the issue seems a couple months old so I'm not sure if it still applies, but what would be a great help is a short page along the lines of WP:MUSIC that gives a couple of criteria for inclusion of such. And I'm asking you since you seem more knowledgeable on the topic (the best I can do is "I've heard of them so they're probably notable" but that argument doesn't work in reverse). Yours, Radiant_* 09:45, Apr 25, 2005 (UTC)

• Ah, not bad. I notice it's an almost literal copy of the BEEFSTEW-guideline often applied to schools. As such I can list my exact same objections - namely that J is POV, and that A, B and C only refer to the length of an article and not to its content (and it's very easy to write lengthy articles with no content, such as a five-page essay on My Goldfish).
• (regarding the acronym - there used to be a Catholic University near where I live that had the same acronynm! Took them a while to catch on, after which they quickly changed their name :) ).
• Yours, Radiant_* 14:03, Apr 27, 2005 (UTC)

2nd Industrial Revolution cleanup started

Hi, can you have a look at what I have doen so far, please and let me know if it makes sense? Apwoolrich 19:21, 25 Apr 2005 (UTC)

How to give articles to other cleanup members

Just for future reference, how do I put articles on other people's desks?
-Voltaire 20:30, Apr 25, 2005 (UTC)

OurColony

Thank you very much for your kind words Katefan0, I fully understood why you cast the VfD and never took it personaly. Wikipedia is better because of the people that guard its veracity. -Jonamerica 02:12, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

GreenFacts dummy...

Hi Katefan0, it's been more than a week now and still not a word from Cacycle on the GreenFacts page. What do you think should be the next step? Should we start editing the main GreenFacts page? Should we try and insist further that he gives his comments on the dummy instead of dismissing it firsthand? Should it be considered an option to put the page up for deletion? Thanks for your help.--PatVanHove 12:47, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

VF-103 -> VFA-103

With a new generation of aircraft the Jolly Rogers are undergoing a change again, this time to VFA-103, please update the link on your user page to reflect this change. PPGMD 15:43, 26 Apr 2005 (UTC)

VfD

Hi there! When you want to make a lot of similar VfD nominations (as with the towers) please consider combining them to keep people from repeating themselves. Radiant_* 09:10, Apr 27, 2005 (UTC)

Thanks!

Thanks for your comments on my work on Basalt fiber and your invitation! I'm looking at Wikipedia:Cleanup Taskforce and might get involved. Thanks again! --G Rutter 12:49, 29 Apr 2005 (UTC)

69.156.18.87 03:33, 1 May 2005 (UTC)

I have no idea what you're talking about.

I noticed you had a run-in with Buckshot

We, meaning Buckshot & I, had a little bit of a flame skirmish via Usenet several years back. I don't know why he's still using that stupid name. I wouldn't take him too seriously--he once started a thread on alt.manicdepression.news entitled, "Manic Depression is Bullsh*t." I think he thinks he's a psychiatrist or something, I don't know--he was always saying stuff like, "My uncle's a scientologist, and blah blah blah."

In the words of SR-71, he clings like cellophane, fake plastic submarine, slowly driving me insane, but now that's over. AlexandraFuller 04:10, 1 May 2005 (UTC)

I know what you mean--that guy needs to chill out and read some of my poetry, which, it's pretty good, if you read it out loud, like it's supposed to be. AllenGinsberg 04:26, 1 May 2005 (UTC)

Instead, you say

Well, you have to understand that I read many books, and sometimes I can read one book and then read another, and the two aren't mutually exclusive, even if the two books were written by different authors. Get it? But seriously: who is this Vega? I don't believe I've ever heard of her b5. AllenGinsberg 06:12, 1 May 2005 (UTC)

Ah so

Well... you know how it is--most of us Beats were either gay or pederasts or both. Cherchez la femme. But, astrologically speaking, woman's influence is always already felt, for example in my poem "You Buxom Young Thing," which was written on behalf of my little sister's shy male lover--and like Freud, my tense relations with women may be indicative of a latent resentment of their power? Again astrologically speaking, the influece of a Cancer/moon child such as Woody Guthrie is not necessarily overshadowed by any/all Leos or Geminis that borrow the influence of the moon, in their sun-drencht agression (sp?). What people see and what goes on are often mutually exclusive, and the "woman behind the man" thing is underrated, IMHO, esp. when bananas are involved. AllenGinsberg 03:23, 2 May 2005 (UTC)

• "I'll take Sour Grapes for 600, Alex." Pissing in corners? You got something against a man's urinary/defecatory habits, and their close link with all creative enterprises? When was the last time you went plop, my dear? Listen: all I'm saying is that there's psychosis & then there's ESP, and then there are those who would elide the difference. Get it? AllenGinsberg 01:44, 3 May 2005 (UTC)

Not fair? Who's the fuckin modernist?

My dear, Dadaism has nothing to do with the price of rice in China. One cunt's nonsense is another cunt's ecstatic lunacy; I would think that yerself would not be opposed to my harnassing the power of the moon. Perhaps methought wrongly. Perhaps I should go scribble my dolphin. Buckshot 05:50, 2005 May 3 (UTC)

Scribbling about dolphins is fine; however, please don't scribble on dolphins. Besides, it'll wash right off. — Knowledge Seeker দ 05:54, 3 May 2005 (UTC)

Wow

It is some interesting stuff isn't it? I actually do edit on other subjects besides UT and other topics related to Texas.  :-)

I really don't remember exactly how I got involved in the debate. I may have been on sexual reproduction which led to sexual intercourse. I noticed that there was some lively debate there, including some people making edits there which I didn't feel were in the interests of Wikipedia. This led to me looking at some user pages to see what other pages these people were involved in. That led to masturbation, gliding action and autofellatio. Whew. I hope you don't mind all the sex talk here!

You see a different side of Wikipedia on those pages where emotions run higher.

I feel it is very important that we maximize the usefulness of Wikipedia to the maximum number of people. I believe there are some who are more interested in promoting their viewpoint or lifestyle or morals. I also believe there are some who want to hold so firmly to their idea of the way the world *should* be that they forget the way the world *is*. I am fairly certain that some of the more explicit images people have tried to add would bring harm to the project, so I spend a few cycles trying to keep us to tamer images that are probably almost as instructive but much less controversial.

Since you are someone whose work I greatly respect, I'd be very interested to hear your views about what you've read so far. Johntex 19:19, 3 May 2005 (UTC)

Jim Robinson VfU

No need to apologize. I can understand not wanting to be misrepresented; I was just afraid that Rangerdude's determination to explain to you what you meant was going to take over the whole VfU page. Happy editing, --TenOfAllTrades (talk/contrib) 20:53, 3 May 2005 (UTC)

It's interesting you say so. I tend to think of the Gemini-moon child as a sort of "ace in the hole," wink wink--did I mention I love Virgos? Well, listen: I've got a big enough family: we've got 3 Geminis, an Aries, a Scorpio, a Leo & a Virgo. Oy gevelt! FeloniousHerzberg 01:59, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

Re: Desk, in defense of...

You should check out my Newsweek article, "In Defense of a Messy Desk"--one pundit called it, "the best thing I ever read in Newsweek." GeorgeFWill 03:20, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

I've also got quite a page turner, even though it's only one page, in the current Special Issue about China. GeorgeFWill 03:21, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

Listen, babe. I don't even know who I am anymore--much less who you and your muppets are. I'm trying to cut through the bullshit. I wanna see you, that's all. No expectations. No promises. No nuthin, I just wanna see your face & know you're alive & see that you're happy. I would like for us to compare notes. Please please PLEASE see me, won't you, gal? FeloniousHerzberg 05:06, 4 May 2005 (UTC)

DD = Daring Diameter/Don DeLillo

A pox upon me for a clumsy lad! But there's one thing you must know: it's merely an expression, a shorthand if you will. Subterfuge. I can't let all the shiksas know how much HEAT = Heavy Ephraim's Apple Tart i'm packin. You know how it is. I'm just hunting for a good will retail outlet, where i can leave furniture/find Betty Boop! Oh no. But seriously, folks, what's a boy gotta do to find some FCNW? where N = 'n. Logistic chicken biscuit, Mitch Winter. About the S-ing, and whether or not: it had to be done, and now I know a little something more about who duddn't know what. Someone should return that to someone, doesn't mean I want it. 66.57.105.182 03:25, 5 May 2005 (UTC)

Are you an Anar-keist?

Yeah, I know what you mean--anarchy is way overrated. I saw a bumper sticker today that said, "Stop Bitching. Start a revolution." I agree--I think the Queen should die, Charles should abdicate, & Wills should be hailed as a great monarch--he will be William II--and just imagine, a movie celebrating his highness, with references to Guy Fawkes. I don't know what could be better. AlexandraFuller6 04:57, 5 May 2005 (UTC)

I just thought of the icing on the cake: a failed asassination attempt on his coronation day. May anarchy perish & hierarchism reign. AlexandraFuller6^{scribble me china} 04:59, 5 May 2005 (UTC)

field trip

I tried your email link and sent a cell number... I hope to find the gang at the Metro station. If not, than maybe the late dinner. Take care, TTLightningRod 14:16, 7 May 2005 (UTC)

UT

Hello, hello, anybody home?? H2O 00:16, 9 May 2005 (UTC)

Hi - I did not mean my edits as a personal attack against you or your school. I just believe that rankings and prestige are overrated. Had I thought they were important, I could easily have attended UT myself or any other school, but after four years of military school I wanted to be closer to my Dad. I believe that who you are inside as a person is much more important than how highly ranked your school is or what kind of degree you have. One of my best friends has a PhD, but you’d never know it, because he doesn’t make a big deal about it. Another friend of mine is a skilled ear, nose, and throat surgeon, but we all know him as Joe. I have no idea where he went to school. If you want to continue to believe that rankings and prestige are that important, that’s fine, but I think as time goes on, you’ll begin to realize that there is more to life. Take care. H2O 17:13, 10 May 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for the ah, er, kind words... BTW I am a Kate Fan, too. My favorite was The African Queen. No innuendo there, please don't psychoanalyze me any more. H2O 22:01, 10 May 2005 (UTC)

Sure, Kate, happy to work on this. --Grouse 17:28, 9 May 2005 (UTC)

problem user

Hello, Katefan0, Soundguy99 here;

At one point you offered to answer any questions I might have, so I'm taking you up on that offer. Actually, it's more of an opinion question than anything else. . . .

I've become aware of a "problem user" (User:Bobber1 aka User:63.147.240.11 fomerly known as User:Bobber2.) He is not entirely useless, but many or most of his edits and articles are either minor or very poor. I suspect he is very young. The catch is that despite multiple attempts by me and occasional attempts by other editors trying to get him to improve, he remains almost totally unresponsive. My question is, would it be appropriate to post something on Village pump (miscellaneous) asking other editors to attempt to contact him, or will I simply be deluged with a chorus of "Don't bother us here, take him to RFC" ? I'm not quite ready to start something as "formal" as RFC, and my hope is that a show of general community attention will make the kid realize that lots of people think he needs to improve. Thanks for any thoughts you have on the subject. Soundguy99 17:31, 9 May 2005 (UTC)

Writing a belated thank you note for your reply to above question. What makes it more frustrating is that I really can't do too much cleaning up after him because he usually writes on subjects I pretty much know nothing about and have little interest in. OTOH, the passage of time seems to be putting more eyes on his edits anyway, several other editors have left messages on various talk pages. And he does seem to be making small steps in improvement; he created an article that was a garbled plot synopsis of a cartoon (House of Bloo's - now merged) but at least he put a "cleanup" tag on it himself (I actually found this pretty funny - "Hi! I wrote this article and it's horrible! Somebody fix it!") and he appears to be "translating" the Ed, Edd n Eddy article into some language from The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy (movie) (???!!!????) but at least he's doing it on the talk page and not in the main article. I think I'll just keep an eye on him for now. Soundguy99 15:49, 15 May 2005 (UTC)

Buckshot

Whew! Looks like someone has been busy.  :-) I apologize for not being able to track this as I wanted. I had an unexpected vacation for a while. I'm back now, so I'll look into it later tonight. Thank you for keeping tabs. Happy editing! SWAdair | Talk 02:59, 10 May 2005 (UTC)

• Yes, ignoring him probably is the best option. It might take a while of simply removing his messages, but sooner or later he'll lose interest. I just blocked 66.57.105.182 for 24 hours for vandalism (history is only vandalism; vandalized Wilco yesterday). Assuming they are all one and the same, and I'm pretty sure you're right about that, that means one day of silence. Oh, and I've gotta hand it to you -- this was excellent!  :-) If he becomes too much of a bother, just let me know and I'll chat with him. Disruption is a blockable offense, after all. Take care. SWAdair | Talk 06:28, 10 May 2005 (UTC)

Sheila Jackson Lee

Hey, for what it's worth, I agree with your criticisms of the article. I don't follow the Texas political scene that closely, so I can't say how significant the criticism is, but it surely doesn't deserve 80% of the article. I think the best outcome is that someone comes along and expands the bio section with information on what she's accomplished and positions she's taken. Barring that, I think the criticisms section should be trimmed, and would be willing to assist in such an effort. I'll write up a brief expansion of her issue postions later--that should help a little. Best, Meelar (talk) 21:25, May 10, 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for getting involved with this article, Kate. I'm not familiar with Lee's career, but I came to the article because I was double checking what appeared to be POV edits from user:68.92.217.49. For someone who keeps being re-elected and who has not been the subject of criminal or ethical investigation, the controversy section does seem excessively large, particularly due to the minor nature of the purported controversies. Cheers, -Willmcw 22:30, May 10, 2005 (UTC)

DC karaoke bars

Man, if only we'd gone to Japone for karaoke... I clearly didn't read this page carefully enough before heading down. Sad that I didn't get to meet you; did you come by at all? Next time, perhaps. +sj + 06:47, 11 May 2005 (UTC)

WRO-Ong

Like I told my friend, The Amazing "You Should See Finger 11" Jedidiah, there's no point in falsifying your personnel file, especially not the "the sketchier the better, it's a memo from Langley, whaddya want" type, because, whew, it's not like SR-71, the famous band whose hit "Right Now" achieved moderate college radio airplay during the Napster era, ever got off the ground, much less was put out to pasture ten (10) years ago, when a Colombia man was known to have said, at least thrice, "We're sick of all this hair band shit." DriveMeSled 03:55, 13 May 2005 (UTC)

Field trip fun?

Yes we did... more than just fun, I think we laid down some nice foundation stones. How's the pet? All OK? TTLightningRod 15:16, 13 May 2005 (UTC)

Yup, quite fun. We'll have to do a D.C. thing again at some point, especially since there were a number of people who expressed interest and couldn't make it. Maybe we can even get Jimbo up here some time. Isomorphic 15:30, 13 May 2005 (UTC)

Sure, seems that I recall Thames and Gyrofrog are local as well. Trading notes, plans and secret handshakes would be fun too. (just gosh'n) The DC local group looks like it will be very influential. Glad to be a part of it. TTLightningRod

"Very influential" is probably an exaggeration, but I was pleased to discover that there is a DC group. When I first looked for local Wikipedians a year or two ago, it didn't seem like there were more than one or two locals that were active regulars. Isomorphic 16:34, 13 May 2005 (UTC)

Yup, had a blast! Too bad you couldn't make it, but I really appreciated your help in planning the trip. Thanks! -- Phyzome is Tim McCormack 02:15, 2005 May 16 (UTC)

Talk:Perverted-Justice.com

Katefan, thanks for letting me know about this article dispute. I have vague memories of looking in on it many months ago, though I didn't get involved. Amazing that it continues: it might be quite a challenge to get it sorted out. I've started by leaving a comment on the talk page, and I agree with the position you took. Perhaps I'll see you there again. ;-) SlimVirgin ^(talk) 07:00, May 18, 2005 (UTC)

What to do with disproportianely big criticism controversies sections?

I saw your question to Will and I have quite a lot of experience on th subject that have big controversy/criticism sections. I have been in many case the one who has been writing the criticisms for subjects that I feel deserve them, see e.g. guru and talk:guru. The Wikipedia system is such that it is nearly impossible to get rid of notable sourced criticism from reputable sources, such as seems to be the case in Houston Chronicle. You can give the article a neutrality warning and then try to dilute the criticism with neutral factual information or find sourced rebuttals. Or better in your case, get others to do this (I am not a candidate for this). Andries 19:22, 23 May 2005 (UTC)

In this case, it is not so hard to find balance. A great deal of the criticism is unsourced, is presented in a POV manner, or is repetitive. Just cutting the criticism down to its sourced, NPOV foundations will help matters. I should add that the essay which recommends avoiding editing autobiographies (wikipedia:autobiography) does not extend to companies where an editor once worked. I don't see any reason why you should not participate, so long as your edits are NPOV. Cheers, -Willmcw 00:58, May 24, 2005 (UTC)

OK, so it may get longer after all. But there's a whole history section yet to be filled in and presumably some rewards to mention, scoops, etc. It'll take some work, but aince it is apparently one of the top ten papers in the nation it's important that we have a good article. -Willmcw 09:35, May 25, 2005 (UTC)

Thanks

Thanks for the invitation to comment. I'll gladly look it over for you. I'll even put it ahead of working on my newest stub-creation; Dusty Mangum. I hope I can find more to say about him than his obvious one big moment of fame, but I think that particular moment is enough to justify inclusion. (others may disagree, we'll see...) Johntex 18:25, 26 May 2005 (UTC)

OK, here are my first impressions. I read the article first and my main impression is that it is almost entirely devoted to discussion of the criticism of the paper. It is not only a question of whehter the criticism is fair or balanced (I need to read again more carefully before commenting directly on that). It is that the article includes almost nothing but a discussion of the criticism. Other than discsussion of the criticism, there is a mention of the circulation figures, and a mere two sentences on the history of the paper. Where is any info on who writes for the paper? awards it has received? topics it covers? The article clearly needs a lot of work.

Then I glanced over the Talk page. Again, I need to read more carefully before I can discuss all the particulars, but I will make one general observation: I both agree and disagree with Rangerdude about keeping information on past controversies. I can see a benefit to maintaining historical information somewhere (besides the edit history), but it can't stay on this main article forever because we have to have room for newer, more current information. Keeping information here about all controversial articles for all time would be a little like keeping a record of all controversial discussions that ever happened in the US Senate over on that page. I would lean towards creation of Houston Chronicle Light Rail Controversy or some similar page to protect a (NPOV) discussion of this. Johntex 18:39, 26 May 2005 (UTC)

I'm still thinking this over but I'm becoming increasingly confident we should split out a bunch of this stuff. That leaves us with a problem of what to call the new page... I am surprised to see that the METRORail article does not make any mention of this Houston Chronicle controversy at all. I no longer live in Houston, but from what I hear there is ongoing controversy over METRORail in general (I.e. flooded switches). The METRORail page only mentions the higher-than-typical crash rate. Perhaps there should be Houston METRORail Controversies, where the light rail collision rate and the Houston Chronicle memo are discussed. Then there could be Houston Chronicle Editorial Controversies which would cover the Iraq stuff and provide a link to Houston METRORail Controversies for the coverage on the memo. What do you think? Johntex 19:20, 26 May 2005 (UTC)

RD has created Texas Media Watch and I have listed on VfD due to them getting a paltry number of Google hits, especially for a so-called media organization. Johntex 03:33, 27 May 2005 (UTC)

RD has now listed Dusty Mangum for VfD. He has also created Dan Patrick (radio host), which I have listed for VfD. Johntex 06:58, 27 May 2005 (UTC)

How's the chat going on over here? Google search for "Dusty Mangum" and "University of Texas" only gets 230 hits, BTW. Rangerdude 07:08, 27 May 2005 (UTC)

I think the chat gets better with the evidence of your hypocrisy: You criticize Google counts when you don't like them but promote them when you do. I'll pray for you. Johntex 07:18, 27 May 2005 (UTC)

Hypocrisy? Nah. I still think google counts are absurd. I don't mind pointing them out though when you're applying a double standard to your own work. Rangerdude 07:30, 27 May 2005 (UTC)

How come I wasn't invited? "Dusty Mangum" and "football" gets 4,960 hits. "Texas Media Watch" gets 1,290 hits. And "Britney Spears" gets 12,200,000 hits. Cheers, -Willmcw 07:22, May 27, 2005 (UTC)

Nice humor, Willmcw. I am not sure any of us are really invited to have this conversation here, so maybe we should leave before the home owner returns and throws us out? Thanks for reminding me not to VfD Britney Spears. <grin> Johntex 07:31, 27 May 2005 (UTC)

• My goodness, I see you little gremlins have been busy. I finish babysitting the Senate, grab a beer and go to bed, and look at y'all. Hey, I don't mind hosting. I have plenty of crash space. · Katefan0^(scribble) 14:28, May 27, 2005 (UTC)

Death and state funeral of Ronald Reagan

I have more to do on the article, but take a look at it. No applause please. :) More to do, but I think it's much improved. I wrote a long post on the talk page of that article...I gave advice to the guy who wrote the article not to do this again. :) 47 pictures and 63 footnotes is down to 14 and 22 respectively. More to do. --Woohookitty 09:03, 28 May 2005 (UTC)

Hey, Texan.

Of that list I just went down and overhauled, you and two other users were the only (active) Texans I could imagine being interested in getting the ball for a Texan Collaboration of the Month rolling. Interested? Shem 04:55, 2 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Cardiovascular disease

Hey, Kate, would you mind taking a look at this article you placed on my desk? I'm nearing completion with it; I'd appreciate any suggestions you might have on areas that could use improvement. I'm not asking you to edit the article, just to give me some feedback. Thanks! — Knowledge Seeker দ 08:17, 3 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for the feedback—I'm glad that you liked the article! On a side note, I hope this won't sound arrogant or self-righteous, but the doctor in me would like to suggest that quitting smoking is probably the single best thing you can do for your health—both now and 50 years from now. Of course, what you decide is up to you, and I'm done preaching. =) — Knowledge Seeker দ 19:13, 7 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Houston Chronicle mediation

Would you object to this mediation to be done public on a subpage of Talk:Houston Chronicle? First of all, I'd like both of you to promise the follow these rules.

1. You won't edit the article while mediation is ongoing. Suspected sockpuppeting should be reported to me personally for investigation.
2. No comments aimed at the other party or their edits should contain loaded language that can be construed as offensive or otherwise hurtful.
3. Mediation should be done in good faith without regard for previous editing behavior.
4. Comments should be made about the other person's edits and not them as a person. If possible you should try to bring sources to the table which I can review.
5. If, somewhere along the way, you think there's a possibility to reach an agreement on any of the disputed points, let it be known as soon as you can.

Please respond to let me know if you agree to follow these rules and whether you object to public mediation. -- Mgm|^(talk) 18:30, Jun 10, 2005 (UTC)

Yes, I would like anyone else who's been involved in the dispute to participate in discussion (maybe some outside view section) and not editing the article would be a great start to that. In fact, it's common practice to protect an article that's subject to mediation, but I was hoping I could keep it open for people unrelated to the dispute. I still haven't heard if you object to mediation on a publically visible page... Mgm|^(talk) 18:42, Jun 10, 2005 (UTC)

• I've started a page for the mediation on Talk:Houston Chronicle/Mediation. Note that I've changed the first rule we agreed on, to accomodate Rangerdude's complaints. Please provide a detailed account of your views on the article and which sections or sentences you consider disputed and provide alternatives you think are better. Wherever possible, please provide sources and diff edits to support your view. If you expressed your views elsewhere, please copy them, rather than providing links. - Mgm|^(talk) 21:42, Jun 12, 2005 (UTC)

Minutemen

Thank you and much respect :) (Cjmarsicano)

Azerbaijani literature

It was protected to deal with the Rovoam vandal. I forgot I had protected it. I have unprotected it now. Please proceed with your improvements! I apologize for not being as attentive as I should have been. Nohat 01:43, 17 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Texas Ranger Division

nice addition ("one ranger, one riot"). thanks. SaltyPig 04:56, 22 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Thank you

Thanks for your support for my adminship. Your nice words are all the more valuable because I know you are sincere and thoughtful. Cheers, -Willmcw 07:56, Jun 24, 2005 (UTC)

me too - belated thanks

Thanks for supporting my RFA nearly a month ago. I am happy to have inspired your first RFA vote! :-) Unfortunately a sad event occurred at that time in my family, and I have not been able to participate in Wikipedia as much as I would like. I hope to get back to active contribution soon. Thanks again! FreplySpang (talk) 01:46, 25 Jun 2005 (UTC)

Price-Anderson Act Thank You

Thank you for reviewing the article, commenting in Discussion, and improving the text. I greatly appreciate the support, and it makes me feel good that such an accomplished Wikipedian confirmed the article's adequacy! Again, many thanks - Simesa 29 June 2005 00:37 (UTC)

You're really very excellent at this, thanks again for all your hard work!

BTW - When they blew up Chernobyl, there were chunks of (unbelieveably radioactive) nuclear fuel lying in the adjacent parking lot - and the Soviets had cleanup crews picking them up with their hands. Simesa 29 June 2005 07:17 (UTC)

In the interests of accuracy, I made the initial stub for Price-Anderson Act. The History shows it. Simesa 30 June 2005 19:45 (UTC)

You are truly an impressive person!

Ben's fixation with PAA seems, from the Discussion, to be linked to the fact that PAA is currently being debated in Congress. I think we should have the article "protected" ("frozen") until that debate is over. Do you know how I go about requesting that?

Thanks! Simesa 30 June 2005 21:14 (UTC)

Note: I'd also want to protect the article Nuclear Power, for the same reason as above. Thanks, Simesa 30 June 2005 22:59 (UTC)

Thanks for your help. This time (and I did consider your experience), I'm going to go ahead and ask for a cooling-off period. Ben sent me a message (feel free to read my user:discussion) basically saying "stop me if you can fairly". I am content with your version of Price-Anderson, and Ben hasn't gotten any better about POV and citing sources. I hope this is sufficient to get us NPOV versions of both articles. Simesa 30 June 2005 23:39 (UTC)

Ben still wants to alter your intro. He wants to battle this time. 216.164.138.57 1 July 2005 02:03 (UTC)

Just for the record - I did create the article - simesa was its first contributor. Tried to search - links can be found (creating the page) in Subsidies under nuclear power going back before simesa began to participate. Benjamin Gatti

Oddly, I was critical of the Price Anderson Act before I realized it was being debating in congress - it appeared when I researched Duck and Cover - some really old old stuff. Yes - it is energizing when your field of inquiry becomes the substance of Presidential speaches - but that isn't the genesis of my involvement on this. Benjamin Gatti

I think you'll find I've contributed a fair number of sources - not huge, but fair, and that my assertions have largely been supported and consistent with the best research - even the DOE which promotes Nuclear admits Price is a subsidy - my core assertion.

I think you've been fair generally - and if you took time to understand the act, you would agree that its the liabiity, and really not primarily a compensation device. Bear in mind Simesa is PAID by the nuclear industry. I am not paid by an energy company (I write software for pictures).

Nuclear was [NPOV] when I found it.

Finally let me join the flattery chorus with "you are a great and wonderful person" - honestly - no one ever agreed with me because i was nice - only because i was right. Not a record i intend to break.

Benjamin Gatti 1 July 2005 03:46 (UTC)

Katefan, Thanks for your reply. I think you will find that every insertion which you deleted was directly sourced - none of it was my opinion, and all of it included indentified sources, both in line and in the reference section - in short the only fault was that a paid member of the industry was uncomfortable with the facts. My question is why isn't it POV if pro-nuclear interest load the articles with obfuscation irrelevencies, and industry slogans? Benjamin Gatti 1 July 2005 04:16 (UTC)

Katefan, Simesa, according to her user page is a "retired nuclear engineer" Last i checked nuclear engineers are paid by the nuclear industry - even their retirement is funded by the nuclear industry. It was her words that things should be frozen "until the PAA is passed" not mine. I think that is enough probable cause of bias to oppose a TRO on those grounds.

Thanks Agains, But Simesa is the moving party here - I didn't file a complaint assulting her integrity - she is filing the complaint insulting mine - in my own defense, i am not bound by courtesy, wikicourtesy or otherwise. Simesa is paid by the industry which is the gravemen here - that is relevent and factual in the context of a defense, in short the assumption of good faith cannot be held against a respondent. Benjamin Gatti 1 July 2005 04:43 (UTC)

Actually, Ben has it wrong again, twice. I am neither retired nor working for the nuclear or power industries. Nor have I ever revealed my gender here. As for wikiettique... Simesa 1 July 2005 06:16 (UTC)

Moving party? Filing a complaint? This isn't a court of law. Nobody has done anything but request the page be protected to discourage edit warring, which I personally think is not a bad idea. As for the spurious claims being thrown about regarding good faith, I'd suggest the best route is to just stop -- at best it's useless and annoying, at worst it's a personal attack. · Katefan0^(scribble) July 1, 2005 16:55 (UTC)

Could I be a Deletionist too?

Since I have been arrested and jailed for cleaning up span advertisments on public parks - would that qualify as a deletionist tendency? if so, count me - and thanks for you're help with Price, I'm having a hell of a time fighting the POV by myself Benjamin Gatti 29 June 2005 02:44 (UTC)

My vote for adminship

Please vote for me. :) I think just the Ronald Reagan article means I should get a vote. :) Wikipedia:Requests_for_adminship/Woohookitty is where to do it. --Woohookitty 29 June 2005 03:42 (UTC)

Thanks for the vote. Believe it or not, I am STILL dealing with SNIYER and the Reagan mess. Every day, he tries to revert stuff I removed. So I'm still battling it. --Woohookitty 29 June 2005 19:22 (UTC)

Thanks. Please put the Death and state funeral of Pierre Trudeau on your list too. Same basic issues. My edits weren't as extensive as on Reagan, but he's pulling the same antics. --Woohookitty 29 June 2005 19:38 (UTC)

Article Idea

This might be fun for someone to write: a "Significant Emotional Event" is a psychology term. As we grow, we learn our place in the world (one popular business course, The Massey Triad, says that at age 10 we look around and say "this is the way the world is"). However, the ways we've learn can be changed - by a sudden severe shock, the Significant Emotional Event. It's my opinion that Army Basic Training (which I went through) is such an SEE. Afterwards, we see the world in a new way, and approach it differently - at least for many years. The change can be very dramatic. Do you know anyone who could write this? Thanks, Simesa 29 June 2005 06:56 (UTC)

Where I am

Yeah, I'm really sorry about that. I should really do less stuff at the same time. Hopefully things haven't escalated in my absence. I'll try to get to it as soon as possible. -Mgm|^(talk) June 29, 2005 16:56 (UTC)

SNIyer12 and the Reagan article

Well I'm glad that I have other partners on that page now. :) Just to give you a heads up, what SNIyer tends to do is to do a ton of edits every day. Now I don't know if he does it to confuse me or what, but he also will add and delete the same stuff over and over again. That's why twice now, I've just copied the article into a text editor and tried to reedit the article again. What I usually do on a daily basis is to go into the history and compare his current version with the last one I've seen. Otherwise, you will get lost in terms of what he's added and subtracted. And he seems to move pictures incessantly. So now we can both try to track it. :) And he does the same thing with the Trudeau article. I don't know how many times I've deleted the same trivia over and over again, such as what the CBC first reported. Thanks for helping. I appreciate it. --Woohookitty 1 July 2005 18:18 (UTC)

Well the problem is that he's one of these people who believes that they "own" articles. I mean I understand putting alot of TLC into an article but he goes beyond that and tries to act like somehow you are violating his space if you touch one of his articles. --Woohookitty 1 July 2005 19:55 (UTC)

Watchlist not updating

Bug 2647: Watchlist not updating [4] --Tagishsimon (talk)

Price-Anderson Edts

I looked in Wikipedia for a medal to give you, but couldn't find anything on commendations. How about a roll of Lifesavers?

Ben sent me a (rambling) note. Interestingly, the last thing he said was "Progress is moving the line of compromise - we are making progress." (Feel free to check my Discussion.) No wonder he doesn't want a Cooling-off Period.

Again, thanks for your perseverance. Simesa 1 July 2005 19:37 (UTC)

SNIyer12

Look at his discussion page. SNIyer12 is his user page. His tactics aren't new. :) He's been threatened with banishment a few times. And apparently, he also has a page at SNIyer1 now as well. You will learn that he is Mr. Flowery with his language. --Woohookitty 2 July 2005 05:11 (UTC)

Yep I'm from Fond du Lac, Wisconsin. I am usually up late. I just had to remove "people stopped what they were doing" for about the 233rd time from an edit by SNIyer12. I think I need a cookie. :) he does it with Reagan and also with Trudeau. His main issue is that he wants to make his articles into narratives and this just isn't the place for it. Anyway, sure I'll help you on your NPOV troubles. I'll take a look in a bit here. --Woohookitty 2 July 2005 05:28 (UTC)

Price-Anderson Article

I see what you mean! My god. There is nothing worse on Wikipedia than...A) Someone with an us v. the world mentality or B) Someone who takes "possession" of an article and won't anyone else touch it. This guy has both! I'll see what I can do to chip in. --Woohookitty 2 July 2005 08:00 (UTC)

Let me know what you think of the paragraphs I wrote on the talk page. I also reordered things a bit. Being a journalist, you understand NPOV. It's not a hard concept, but that guy seems to think that this is a "forum". I'm a liberal...it's hard for me to do the Reagan article at times...but...it doesn't matter. And why that's so hard for people to "get into", I don't know. Our views mean squat here. Zip. Zippo. Nada. Zilch. I have a feeling I'm going to find myself searching for quotes in support of Price-Anderson. I feel so lucky! ;-) --Woohookitty 2 July 2005 08:57 (UTC)

Well I've done some work on it. I think I'm going to try to keep Ben "honest". Yes, some of the statements in the fact section should be backed up but he also has a couple of VERY dubious sources of his own. He cites a Public Citizen article that cites facts he doesn't have citations for. --Woohookitty 2 July 2005 21:17 (UTC)

Really now, in spite of having introduced Price Anderson (in Nuclear Debate), I don't claim ownership in any way and never have. I only found it ironic that I was being criticised for "poor" contributions on a subject which wouldn't exist at all without my having contributed it - not ownership just irony. I don't object to being kept honest - if you go back and look at the initial stub - you will see it has blatent lies - which have been corrected. Katefan made the most progress by incorporating most if not all of my criticism. just a few more inaccuracies to go. Benjamin Gatti 2 July 2005 23:57 (UTC)

I've added back in the section on Chernobyl-vs-Western reactors, with 4 cites. I agree the cites should have been there earlier. This comparison is critical. Simesa 3 July 2005 11:05 (UTC)

(message deleted by author)) Simesa 3 July 2005 18:35 (UTC)

"You don't get to edit redirects because the page is protected." first of all - you're no fun (kidding) second, the protected page is not properly listed under protected pages - as such the action taken to protect the page circumvents the rules of wiki - it is the duty of editors to make every possible effort to remove POV and baseless assertions from articles. The assertion that a nuclear accident in the US would likely be less is unverifyable as it reads, and includes weasel words - it is up for mediation perhaps you would care to participate by commenting in the mediation section - meanwhile i'm off to remove your pov violation from an article.

Remember

My vote is 15-0-0 right now, so I might be able to do it myself by Tuesday night. :) --Woohookitty 3 July 2005 03:32 (UTC)

Yeah I know. Conflict of interest yadda yadda. :) We might have to just send it to arbitration. If you didn't see it, go back before my reversion tonight and look at what Ben added tonight. ALL POV. I think it's just useless to continue this. --Woohookitty 3 July 2005 03:37 (UTC)

You know

You would think that after all of this, Ben would know what "neutral" means. Using words like "paltry" isn't exactly NPOV. --Woohookitty 3 July 2005 21:40 (UTC)

Image:Johnnyisakson.jpg

Image deletion warning

Image:Johnnyisakson.jpg has been listed at Wikipedia:Images and media for deletion. If you feel that this image should not be deleted, please go there to voice your opinion.

--Admrboltz 4 July 2005 08:56 (UTC)

Price-Anderson Mediation

If you think Mediation is the next best step, I agree to go along with it. However, Ben's got it wrong - it's not binding. I'd be looking for new mutual solutions, not simply caving in to Ben which is what he hopes for - his attitude is that as long as he's talking, he's winning. My attitude is that the article can't get any more slanted. Simesa 4 July 2005 14:33 (UTC)

Okay, I signed up for mediation.

What citations do we need for Ben's proposed text? I suggested the PBS one for the nuclear parts, do we need citations for "nuclear energy continues to have a higher degree of risk than the free market is willing to insure" and "continues to be necessary"? Simesa 4 July 2005 20:37 (UTC)

On the related topic of Nuclear Power - The RfC is under "Politics" - should I move it to "Engineering & Technology", or would that be a social error at this time? Nuclear Power, also under protection, has been inactive while we've been discussing PAA. I annotated the PAA RfC entry to say that we're headed for mediation. Simesa 4 July 2005 22:02 (UTC)

Since the functional differences are over politics, I would tend to say just leave it there. But it wouldn't be any great faux pas to move it under a different subject heading, or possibly even list it twice I guess. · Katefan0^(scribble) July 4, 2005 22:11 (UTC)

Thank you. I may list it twice - I'll think about it for another day. I don't want controversy over Nuclear Power to disrupt our possible progress on PAA. Simesa 5 July 2005 18:43 (UTC)

User Dan100 moved Nuclear Power for us. Simesa 6 July 2005 17:32 (UTC)

Ben's in a hurry to discuss PAA, so I suggested he post a proposed article and then I asked Uncle_Ed to expedite a Mediator for us. (I hope that wasn't a bad idea.) Simesa 6 July 2005 06:44 (UTC)

Please accept Uncle Ed on the RfM page. (I think we're lucky to have gotten him!) Simesa 6 July 2005 17:28 (UTC)

Copies of Our Pages

I was searching for some citations when i saw that [5] appears to be a carbon-copy of our Nuclear power page. Ditto for [6] and Nuclear power plant. Wikipedia is credited in the fine print at the very bottom. Is this a problem? Simesa 6 July 2005 19:21 (UTC)

Restore pages?

I saw that you erase a commentary as i put to User:MacGyverMagic. Can not let be that question why? 82.101.146.133 7 July 2005 00:25 (UTC)

Aiken

I'm with you about not feeding the trolls. Thanks for your encouragement and enjoy your book! Hermione1980 8 July 2005 12:41 (UTC)

All right — I was just fixing to write up a 3RR vio myself. You're much quicker on these things than I am! Hermione1980 8 July 2005 18:17 (UTC)

FYI, I just made a proposal on the talk page that I think gets at some comments you made earlier, that the OC group helps bolster the "gay speculation" paragraph. It's on the talk page, but I'll reproduce it here in case you haven't seen it. If you have a minute, I'd appreciate your thoughts. I thought on this a bit last night, and if what folks are unhappy with is having Openly Clay listed in the external links because its fan base isn't large enough compared with the top, say, two or three, how about then just listing it in the text? It seems to me that it could be naturally incorporated into the paragraph on gay speculation. Something like: Some have speculated that Aiken is gay, and indeed there exists a group of fans who enjoy discussing the rumor (link). However he has denied such suggestions and in fact good-naturedly lampooned the rumors by playing a member of a gay chorus when he appeared as a musical guest on Saturday Night Live's February 7, 2004 show. It's in proper context, isn't "in your face" about the group, but ensures that it's mentioned and linkable somewhere. What do you think? · Katefan0^(scribble) 15:38, July 12, 2005 (UTC)

• I like this idea, and support it 100%. In related news, i'll be giving the site in question a good lookover tommorrow, as I'm rather busy today. --Blu Aardvark | ^{(talk) | (contribs)} 01:32, 13 July 2005 (UTC)

Do you think that matters have settled down enough to lift the protection? It seemed like an agreement was almost in place when I stuck my big nose in and riled everyone up again. Have the outside editors become bored and left? -Willmcw 04:04, July 15, 2005 (UTC)

Katefan - I have been following the Clay Aiken discussion and subsequent dilemma closely. However, because it has been going on for sometime and the interested parties have already been established, I do not want to add a new name to the mix at this crucial time. It seems so close to resolution. I would like to impart a few thoughts for your consideration. I hope I am entering this properly. If not, I sincerely apologize.

I believe the most recent entry made by Wilykit 11:18, July 15, 2005 (UTC) is, so far, the one most seem to agree with. To me it is the most unbiased toward either 'camp' as well as the most factual. However, I feel some of the wording is a bit clumsy and unnecessary. As my name suggests, I tend to revise, and anally so. For your consideration. IMO, a better read.

Due to the speculation within American popular culture that he is gay, Aiken has been the subject of gay jokes by Conan O'Brien, Kathy Griffin, Saturday Night Live, and Mad TV, among others. While there are a few communities [9] among his many internet fan sites who speculate about his sexual orientation, the majority do not. Aiken denied he was gay in a Rolling Stone interview in June, 2003, and, in fact, good-naturedly lampooned such speculation in a skit featuring him as a member of a Gay Men's Chorus when he appeared as the musical guest on Saturday Night Live, February 7, 2004 [7].

Factual. Sourceable. Concise. Thanks. --AnalRevisionist 16:08, 15 July 2005 (UTC)

College pics on Texas article

I was conducting back channel (as in on user talk) negotiations between Zershk and UH Collegian when you posted your comment. Zershk has taken your oppostion to remove MD Anderson (which was only one of several possibilities) as an invitation to pull out of the negotations and propose a vote on it. I'm certain that your post was not meant to encourage one side to think it had a hand up on the other. Could you please help me get Zershk back to the table or at least join me in opposing the vote, the vote is no more a permanent solution than the negotiation and at least with the negotiaions one user wouldn't be mad as hell (with the potential to go into edit war mode). I'd appreciate your help Kate. Thanks Jay 00:10, July 10, 2005 (UTC)

Its getting the personal issues detangled from the content issues that are hard. That's what required a more personal setting, any content change proposals would have been/will be posted on the Talk:Texas page. Hopefully UH Collegian will reciprocate Zershk's apology, by apologing for what he did wrong (meeting Zershk's demands), and negotiations can continue. Until then, if I'm away and the boys misbehave please send them to their rooms. :) -JCarriker 04:33, July 10, 2005 (UTC)

• BTW there is something in my sandbox that may interest you. -JCarriker 05:01, July 10, 2005 (UTC)
  • Please give me your opinion on this as soon as possible. -JCarriker 15:59, July 12, 2005 (UTC)
    • Please monitor Talk:Texas#Compromise on College pics. Thanks. -JCarriker 23:58, July 12, 2005 (UTC)

Curious

How'd it go with Mr. Ed, Edd and Eddy? · Katefan0^(scribble) June 30, 2005 18:58 (UTC)

• You know, I'd practically forgotten about him. . . . Triumph of the WikiWay, I suppose, is the current result. After a minor skirmish over his creation of unnecessary and poorly-written character articles, which I kept blanking and redirecting, he got involved in several other articles where his poor contributions quickly got reverted and barked at by other editors, and he seems to have lately confined himself (mostly) to minor but accurate edits. Plus, adding some confirmation to another editor's (I forget who) vague IP check tracing him to a Texas school system, his editing became much more sporadic about mid-May and seems to have ceased entirely by mid-June. So either he's lost interest, or he just doesn't have easy Internet access now that school's out. We'll see what happens come Sept or so. Thanks for asking. Interestingly enough, Wikipedia seems to be one of the few cases in the universe where ignoring a problem will make it go away by itself. . . . . . .  ;-) Soundguy99 16:30, 10 July 2005 (UTC)

Nuclear Power Protection

Hi, I was checking today, and El_C unprotected Nuclear Power. My concern is that we'll have editwarring restart there and the hot emotions spill over into our mediation on Price-Anderson. I've asked El_C to restore protection - could you add your opinion? Simesa 21:55, 11 July 2005 (UTC)

Kate - If you would address the mediator instead of asserting policy and telling us why we are all here, it seems it would be helpful. That last post is very long and I don't see much "meat" in it. You accuse me of having an opinion - that is the assumtion of mediation, we all understand that opinions are flying hot and heavy - if you think Uncle Ed needs to hear that someone has an opinion, that's fine - i just don't think its necessary. also, under the rules of mediation, you should phrase your policy position as a question as its disrespectful to the process for each participant to be telling the mediator what the policy is or should be. Benjamin Gatti

I quoted policy that bore on my point, which is entirely appropriate. My point went beyond that you have an opinion (obviously everyone has opinions) to what I believe is the heart of your misunderstanding of NPOV and Wikipedia's mandate, i.e. a crusade for "truth." I'm sorry if that offended you, I didn't intend for it to. I don't see any rules of mediation that require me to phrase anything in particular as a question, and I believe I did direct all my comments to Ed. If you felt that point was ambiguous in any way then I will try to do better with my future comments. · Katefan0^(scribble) 15:06, July 12, 2005 (UTC)

Hi, Ben seems to be in a hurry. This may be because he is speaking one day at an INCEED conference in Charlotte July 24-30, and may choose to stay for the entire conference. I have no problem delaying the mediation(s) for a week, but I hesitate to bring this up in the mediation page. Any thoughts on how we might approach this? Simesa 23:10, 12 July 2005 (UTC)

HMA/H-SL-BMA

Sorry I forgot to respond after archiving my talk page. If you must, then I agree to change it back to Houston Metropolitan Area. I moved the page early in June and I did it because I am just picky about name designations, especially from the U.S. Census. I am just fond of official/legal designations since I am an accounting major (most accountants are anal about legality like I am) and of course I am a believer of the U.S. Census. Yes, I am aware that no one calls it Houston-Sugar Land-Baytown Metropolitan Area, but official/legal type of business conduction does. Every real estate reports I have read designated the official title. I am also aware that no one called it Houston-Galveston-Brazoria back then either. As I result of how I feel about the official naming convention and Wikipedia being an encyclopedia, I thought changing the name of the page would be more correct. I did not mean any harm to this.

If you still want to change it back, I would like to have both naming conventions on the Houston page as well, not just the main metro page. It would look something like this... "Houston is the cultural and economic center of the Houston-Sugar Land-Baytown area, a title designated by the U.S. Census...the area is colloquially known as the Houston Metropolitan Area..." or if you can think of a better way to word it. I also know the differences between hyphens and dashes. I like to use short dash (not mdash) instead of hyphen because, in my opinion, it is more appealing and easier to distinguish than the real hyphen, which is short, small, and I have a hard time seeing it. The hyphen makes two words seem so close. Would you mind if I use short dashes instead of hyphens or would that bother you?

As for the compromise on the Texas school pictures, I did not see it as a compromise because there was no gain or loss for me. I said before on the talk pages of JCarriker and Texas, I did not want any pictures to be removed. I only reacted the way I did because of how that user was persistent with removing the picture I put in that section. Even after his argument for removal, I never demanded any of his five (5) pictures that he put up to be removed. UH Collegian 17:50, 15 July 2005 (UTC)

Houston article

User Hottentot has been giving me a hard time in the last two days and he keeps on reverting the Houston information box which is now on a template. He did it again today just now and I want it to stop. Is it possible to put a lock on that template? Template:Houston Infobox UH Collegian 17:58, 15 July 2005 (UTC)

short dash: Houston–Galveston

long dash: Houston—Galveston

regular hyphen: Houston-Galveston UH Collegian 18:04, 15 July 2005 (UTC)

Oh yeah, please make the change for me. UH Collegian 18:06, 15 July 2005 (UTC)

Two or three days ago, that user got rid of the info box that I custom made for Houston and replaced it with a generic version that was made by someone to pass it around. The old version looks like this [7]. I did not revert his change since I acknowledged that he put in some time to change the information plate and style. All I did was corrected the information he had put on there. Prior to this, he has never edited the Houston or any Texas article at all and now he is starting a revert war on me. As a result, I moved the info box to the template and added the link on the main page for the template. Now he changed it back to the "default" version of having the flag at 110px and 120px for the seal. I know this is silly, but the size of the images has been 150px for both prior to me discovering this place. Now he takes an interest with messing with the Houston article and an edit war with me because of that. UH Collegian 18:21, 15 July 2005 (UTC)

Question

You said on the Talk:Clay Aiken page that you're not an admin. Seriously? Why not? Kate's Tool shows you have about a billion edits (4299 to be precise :-) and you seem to be quite level- and cool-headed in an argument. Hermione1980 22:24, 15 July 2005 (UTC)

Disambig metro area

Hey! Sorry you had to go through so much trouble changing the links and names back. You could have asked me to do it for you. I like your copyedits on the Houston page as that article is very long and wordy. I shortened it like a month and a half ago and used the {{inuse}} tag as well. The size was 70KB and I shorted it to 52KB. I moved a lot of lists away from the main page to its own article. UH Collegian 22:37, 16 July 2005 (UTC)

List of warez groups VfD

See List of warez groups. Your call, but what really concerns me is that someone has managed to protect this while on VfD. IMHO, most of the redlinks are notable with rare exception. —RaD Man (talk) 04:11, 17 July 2005 (UTC)

Tributes by world leaders on the death of Ronald Reagan

Trying to tell me something, Kate? :) Email me if you don't want to say it here. --Woohookitty 01:47, 18 July 2005 (UTC)

DHarjo

I just wanted to let you know this before you get to deeply engaged in debating this user: I suspect DHarjo is a sock-puppet of CPret. CPret is the individual who posted American West up for deletion, when the redirect vote didn't go his way. If this is the same person, he has no intention of admitting that Texas has any ties to the South. He also rejects Missouri, and other states that border the Mississippi claims to being part of the West, and the modern inclusion of Alaska and Hawaii. CPret is only interested in seeing his view of the West written in stone, negotiating or reasoning with him is not possible, I tried and the more patient Jmabel tried harder. Of course, as with most sock puppets I can't prove it beyond a shadow of a doubt, but I doubt he would have acted so hostile to me when I referred him on the archive if he wasn't previously invloved and his language and tactics are similar to CPret's. I've also found evidence that the user is either ignorant or disingenuous about the cultural classification of the Caddo, which are classed as either members of the Southeastern or Eastern Woodlands culture rather than as Plains Indians. I found my debate with CPret (DHarjo) to be frustrating, futile, and tiring. I wouldn't want you to have to go through the same thing, and I wouldn't want to feed the troll by letting him know what I suspect, so I thought I'd give you a heads up on my suspicions. -JCarriker 04:40, July 18, 2005 (UTC)

Islamists at CAIR

You know, when the truth about organizations like CAIR is exposed, you'd think people would be grateful.

but no, they just hide their heads in the sand praying the Muslims won't stick a sword to their throat and demand they repeat the Heil Allah. User:168.150.251.36

Sorry I've only just seen your note about the above user. He's stopped now, so either he got bored or some other admin did the nasty deed. Theresa Knott (a tenth stroke) 21:05, 18 July 2005 (UTC)

You've won an award!

You get the plain ol' barnstar from Woohookitty for doing all of the jobs that no one else wants to do!

With all of the requests for comments you do, you deserve it. I'd pay ya if I could. :) --Woohookitty 22:07, 19 July 2005 (UTC)

Users who endorse this view:

• You've earned it! -Willmcw 06:51, July 20, 2005 (UTC)
• Yes, me too! This person named Katefan keeps showing up on my watchlist... --Dmcdevit·t 08:21, July 20, 2005 (UTC)

VfD

FYI Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/Perverted-Justice.com SlimVirgin ^(talk) 01:02, July 20, 2005 (UTC)

Page protection

Sorry, I haven't been around lately. I hope your page protection issues got sorted out. --Dante Alighieri | Talk 05:33, July 20, 2005 (UTC)

UH College vs. Rice College

Perhaps a comporomise of whichever intstitution is mentioned first in the text can be the second image displayed. Beleive it or not that is actually the status quo. However, there is far to much information on UH in that section; UH info needs to be reduced and info on Rice and the other institutions needs to be expanded. As a side issue please read over WP:USR and tell me if you would be interested joining in a participant. -JCarriker 15:30, July 25, 2005 (UTC)

SNIyer1 RfC

Katefan, thanks for letting me know about this. It's unfortunate timing in a way, as this editor has recently begun to change, I think in a way that is hard for him. I'm not sure whether to say something positive, or just leave well alone. I'm still thinking about it. ;-) SlimVirgin ^(talk) 06:51, July 26, 2005 (UTC)

Possible RFC

CPret has slipped and admitted he's DHarjo and has threatened to POV Western United States. I've asked several users to protect Western US and American West, and Nixie has. I'm tired of dealing with this POV troll and his childish antics, if I file an RFC against him, reluctantly even now, would you participate in it possibly confirm it? Thanks. (BTW UH Collegian's not giving you too much trouble is he. I can talk to him if you want.) -JCarriker 12:20, July 26, 2005 (UTC)

Me again

This time with Wikipedia:Votes for deletion/Tristar and Red Sector Incorporated. The second half admittedly does look horrible, the result of two people writing different articles on the same group, each not being cognisant of the other, and then being merged together. —RaD Man (talk) 14:35, 26 July 2005 (UTC)

Houston, Texas article

I would appreciate it if you would not propose any cutting of the pictures on the article. I have worked really hard the past 2 months to find pictures that were free use and PD. Why must you always propose to cut my edits? I don't get it. You have propose to change the article too much aleady, please give it a break. With the adding of pictures the past few months, I have left pictures that were added by other users intact still. I request that you not move the pictures I put up or any other users' picture that they have put up. All I am trying to do for the Houston article is to bring it up to featured article standards, that's all. I also want it to look nice. UH Collegian 19:10, 26 July 2005 (UTC)

Okay, I will replace some of the pictures with a different setting. Just give me some time to go look for new pictures. UH Collegian 19:42, 26 July 2005 (UTC)

The pictures were never disputed to begin with. It has been there and intact for a while. Also, from what I am seeing, you are discussing your proposals exclusively with Jleon, not with the "community". Also, you said the "community"...what community? There are basically four people editing the Houston article on a regular basis and posting on talk page — that is us, WhisperToMe, and Rockhopper10r. These four people really the ones that care about the Houston article and it seems none of what I do really matter since you are discussing and getting consensus from Jleon exclusively. Jleon only edited the Houston article twice and that was to remove something he did not like. He is from New York City and really think low of Houston. Why dont we just use that picture of NASA from your userpage. I like that one. UH Collegian 20:01, 26 July 2005 (UTC)

I never agree to a consensus or compromise. I never said anything about a consensus or compromise. You just brought it upon yourself and demand it to be a compromise and/or consensus on the talk page and then start proposing without my consensus. This is a dispute you have brought on and is between you and I. There you go again with flying out with compromises and proposal. Again, this is a dispute between you and I. You started this whole dispute of pictures thing and now you want some of it removed. I don't care if people add more pictures but I have never removed any of the pictures that were added by another user, even though I didn't like some of it. I do not mind you adding NASA and if you want, I can find a nice shot of NASA, but don't do in place of any pictures. Also, the panoramic Downtown Houston pic stays. If you were to look at other citites, they have multiple shots of downtown as well. I got all these ideas from other pages. UH Collegian 20:18, 26 July 2005 (UTC)

I never said I disagree with your NASA picture. If you have pictures that depict the culture of Houston, then please do add it to the page. You don't need a consensus if you want to add a picture. Please go ahead and add it. I always welcome pictures to any page and never demand it to be taken down or given anyone a hard time about it. I have never started a dispute with anyone because I did not like what they do or the pictures they put up. Believe me. In the mean time, why don't you just add that NASA picture to the article and whatever pictures overflow that I added, I will remove it just like I have been doing. I have removed some of the pictures that I put up throughout time after your copyedits since it did not fit anymore. I didn't even give you a hard time about it. Do you acknowledge that I have been removing pics after your copyedits because it didn't fit anymore and that I never gave you a hard time about it? UH Collegian 20:36, 26 July 2005 (UTC)

Since you have brought up the picture issue...I will tell you that there is a picture under the climate section that doesn't have anything to do with the Houston article. I am not going to remove it because I don't want to offend anyone. Maybe you can bring that issue up or something. Most of the pictures I find on Houston are buildings. When I find a replacement of non-buildings, I will replace it. UH Collegian 23:11, 26 July 2005 (UTC)

• Hey y'all! Why don't both of you take a wikibreak of a week from editing the Houston page? It could give y'all's nerves a rest and allow the other side to become clearer. BTW way if you want an offical mediation I am a real Mediator now. Just file one at WP:RFM and request me. (P.S. Isn't your edit count getting a little high not to be an admin.) Thanks.- JCarriker 12:53, July 28, 2005 (UTC)

Thumbnail

To make this as easy as possible I'm going to provide in bullets:

• 16:50, October 29, 2004 CPret turns American West, a redirect into U.S. West, into a POV duplicate article that attacks the existing article specifically the Census bureau model, put forth in the article. The duplicate contains phrases like "the stars are bigger and brighter in the West" and attacks the census model for including TX & OK in the South and KS-ND in the Midwest. (I notice this immediately, already highly stressed out, I decide to take a wikivacation, confident that someone else will deal with it. I returned in January 2005)
• In May 2005 Wikiproject U.S. regions passes a policy standardizing naming conventions for U.S. regions and begins posting notices of immenient moves on article talk pages. This brings dealing with the duplicate article, which still exists in violation of wikipedia policy, to a head as it needs to be merged with U.S. West at Western United States.
• I post the notice on talk American West that the page will be moved, and make the mistake of offering my opinion that the article never existed in the first place. CPret/DHarjo responds.
• A long drawn out convesation ensues, CPret/DHarjo claims that U.S. West was solely about the Census bureau region and that he was within his right to create American West. I provide links which show that U.S. West was not just about the census bureau region [8] and that his interpretation of policy is wrong [9]. He ignores them, and accuses me of lying (when I wrote the policy even).
• The conversation devloves into circular arguments as CPret/DHarjo ignore eveidence that contradicts them. I post American West on Rfc and draw no response.
• I then post a three day survey on Talk:American West (This is where you entered I believe). I notify everyone involved CPret sees he's lost and posts American West on Vfd and acts as if he has left, when in reality he has had a sockpuppet account DHarjo all along who now enters the debate at American West.
• DHarjo, a user I had previously not encountered, attacks me when I answer a question on Talk:American with unusal hostility and knowledge of the arguement.
• On Talk:Western United States DHarjo slips and says, I read those before I named my first article., CPret created and this statement confirms my suspicion that CPret and DHarjo are one and the same.

This arguement is wearing me out, CPret/DHarjo has already made it clear that he only wants his view of the West in the article and no other. He has been provided with sources, anyone who reads Talk:American West and its archive can see that. He made me angry from day one and I could and should have behaved better myself, but after months of seeing nothing done, and then debate going nowhere for months I was and am tired. However he, is the only person on the page that is trying to suppress alternate views, I merged his with the Western US article myself, and in so doing became the first person to include Texas-North Dakota on the actual page and setting a precedent for future inclusion, so his counter claims that I am trying to suppress information are bogus. Infact anyone who reads the WikiProject U.S. regions page, which mostly my baby, will see that the entire project is about inclusion and acknowledging that defintions vary, region overlap, and that there is diversity within regions. At the least CPret/DHarjo is disengenuous, and I'm sick of having to put up with his intolerance and ignorance. -JCarriker 21:58, July 26, 2005 (UTC)

DYK

Did you know? has been updated. A fact from the article Houston Ballet, which you recently created, has been featured in that section on the Main Page. If you know of another interesting fact from a recently-created article, then please suggest it on the "Did you know?" talk page.

Elizabeth Bentley, et al

Katefan: I welcome your interest and help on the Elizabeth Bentley article, you have been a valuable neutralizing voice there. It should be noted, the original User who placed the dispute tag [10], has since most graciously resolved the dispute User_talk:Nobs01#Espionage-related_articles (and notified another editor of the same intentions). User:Ruy Lopez was informed last night User_talk:Ruy_Lopez#Notice I no longer regard his edits in good faith, and have evidence to back up such claim. There are other actions pending against this User (including persistent vandalism through the use of sockpuppets), and I will either participate in them or initiate my own. It is an unfair burden placed upon my time, to deal with both his persistent vandalism, and document his behavior. It is evidenced by the fact (1) he has initiated other disputes, yet never articulates the nature of the dispute on the Talk page; (2) he demands sourcing, yet reverts properly sourced material and inserts unsourced material; (3) has engaged in no effort to resolve disputes. Given the subject matter of the Elizabeth Bentley article, this behavior could spread to potentially 80+ other articles. nobs 18:24, 29 July 2005 (UTC)

RFC

Kate, would it be possible for you to certify an RFC against DHarjo/CPret. If so you can find a rough draft in my sandbox history, which I will be moving back to the main page momentarily. -JCarriker 07:18, August 4, 2005 (UTC)

Go enjoy you're dip, albeit at 2:30AM I might add :). I'll wait unitl Tuesday and see if Khaosworks can do anything. However, please confirm that you intend to certify not just comment on the RFC. The RFC would fail without a secound certifier. Thanks. -JCarriker 07:31, August 4, 2005 (UTC)

Personal Attacks

Kate - there are many places to attack me - but I think it unecessary to go interjecting every article with every other article for nothing more than the sake of harrasment. I've been accused of favoring Ed on this and of attacking him on this (Rubbing salt in the wounds were Simesa words) the truth is, i probably wouldn't have known about the incident, if I wasn't watching Ed Page - but beyond that - there is no relation. Ed hasn't mediated anythiing for several lifetime in Wikitime, and I'm certainly not fishing for favors - you know me well enough to know that I don't bend over backward to be on people's good side. I could have curried you for the same reasons - did I ever? probably the opposite. I believe i go out of my way to be brusque - perhaps for no other reason than to avoid the kind of sleasy remarks you made. If you intend to follow me around and drag every debate into every other debate - i'll have to object. thank you. Benjamin Gatti

If you could, please show me where I have inserted your presence into "every article" -- I'd appreciate it. Otherwise you may prefer to modify your remarks. I have a right to comment on a VfD just like everybody else. I'm sorry you didn't appreciate my words, but I felt like it was necessary since the discussion was already on the subject of potential conflicts of interest. At least we can both agree that censorship is bad -- right? Also, I never made a personal attack against you -- I never said you WERE currying favor, or that I thought you were currying favor, or anything approaching it -- I said it could have that appearance, which is far from a personal attack. On the other hand, capriciously painting comments you dislike as personal attacks can be construed as itself a personal attack, though I won't press this issue. I will, however, insist on my comments being left intact. · Katefan0(scribble) 21:43, August 4, 2005 (UTC)

Ben misses the point as usual. He complimented Ed for something Ed had already apologized for doing.

BTW - Ben has agreed to return to Mediation, and Ed says he has new ideas. For now, the article is in the "text moved" mediation state. Simesa 07:44, 6 August 2005 (UTC)

Energy Policy Act of 2005

I have yet to find a source for the contents of the final bill, or even a halfway-detailed summary! This is very frustrating, and if you know of a source I would appreciate it. Simesa 13:33, 9 August 2005 (UTC)

Thanks for responding. I still haven't seen a good source, but I found an early-version one on the House Energy Committee website so I e-mailed them this morning and asked for an updated page. If I get a response I intend to re-write our article. Simesa 17:51, 9 August 2005 (UTC)

WP:WPB

Heh, sorry -- didn't see your note on the talk page of Brewery Ommegang until now, and I guess it's been a while since you left it. I like the idea of a "regional exchange," but I don't really think it'd work out... I'm in Canada, and here (in this province) there's all sorts of dumb regulation of beer, can't find much beyond the oligopobeers (which amusingly are no longer Canadian, since the companies have been bought up), and it'd be kinda tricky to move any actual beer about, e.g. over borders. But thanks anyway, and I like your contributions so I hope you keep up with the wikibeer project. All the best! --Daniel11 17:27, 9 August 2005 (UTC)