Talk:Eltham

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Disambiguation[edit]

Eltham is also an outer suburb of Melbourne, and probably as well-known as Eltham, England. It is a popular location for artists, and therefore not unlikely that an article will get written about it at some stage. Therefore, this might need to be made a disambiguation page. --Robert Merkel 00:46 16 Jul 2003 (UTC)

Lawrence[edit]

  • I have noticed that Stephen Lawrence is listed as a "Famous Resident" of Eltham. Please cite where and when, he lived in Eltham.Lion King 23:02, 6 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]
  • I have been informed by a member of The Eltham Society, that Stephen Lawrence was not at any time, a resident of Eltham. Also, that at the time of his tragic murder, he was a resident of Woolwich SE18. I have, therefore, deleted him as a famous Eltham resident.Lion King 18:28, 11 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Shame we cannot list the blokes who "allegedly" did for him, who most definitely were Eltham residents. The point is that the 1993 killing was a defining moment in London's history, so it needs more than half a line on the Eltham page. It was reported in the papers as far away as Ouagadougou, West Africa, where I was living - the fallout has been enormous. It is intimely linked to Eltham, through the MacPherson report.

  • To the best of my knowledge, only one of the suspects was an Eltham resident. The others were from Bromley and Kidbrooke, which is very close to where Stephen was murdered. We must be very careful about demonising the people of Eltham because of the alleged actions of mindless racist morons. As for naming the suspects, Wikipedia cannot be susceptible to any resulting law suit appertaining to defamation. Best wishes, Lion King 13:49, 9 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Culture and Identity[edit]

Will someone please give me the location of the "apartment blocks" in Eltham? I have been there several times and didn't notice any "apartment blocks". Thanks, Lion King 19:17, 9 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The section wreaks of OR, needs some sources and bringing up to date. Its trying to say the area is prodimantly white working class, like say Dagenham, but thats all it needs to say, perhaps backed up with so demographic info. I think there was some early slum clearance in central SE London that moved people here, that may explain it. I'll see if I can dig something up. MRSC 23:29, 27 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks, I have a feeling that someone may be including the housing estates in Kidbrooke into the Eltham area, just a thought. Cheers Lion King 00:24, 28 August 2006 (UTC)[reply]
51°27′07″N 0°02′58″E / 51.4519°N 0.0495°E / 51.4519; 0.0495 Here are the coordinates of three high (for the area) residential tower blocks near Eltham High Street, about 10 stories. Look on Google Maps satellite and you can see them and their shadows. Carlwev (talk) 09:36, 5 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Apartment/Flat blocks in Eltham can be found at: Sowerby Close (three 10-storey blocks), Strongbow Crescent (two 9-storey blocks), Well Hall Road (one 13-storey block), Wythens walk (one 8-storey block). There are also many other 4 or 5 storey blocks in areas such as Tarnwood Park and Middle Park. Mkimemia (talk) 09:31, 18 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]
Not quite the North Peckham Estate then? 'Arry Boy (talk) 21:33, 5 June 2008 (UTC)[reply]
The North Peckham Estate comprises of 2 and 3 storey dwellings. My post above gives the location of several 'apartment blocks' in Eltham, which is what Lion King asked for. Mkimemia (talk) 08:10, 2 October 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Added Internal Links[edit]

I have added Internal Links to this article. User:Kathleen.wright5 14:59, 22 September 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Ethnicity and statistics[edit]

Under "Migration and Ethnicity" we read

The white population of Etham is 86.7%, which is below the national average of 92.2%. Furthermore, the population of Black and Asian origin are both respectively higher than the national average. This makes Eltham more ethnically diverse than most districts in the United Kingdom, although relatively less than some of its neighbours such as Woolwich.

I question the conclusion that having a higher proportion of black and Asian-origin people makes the mix more diverse. Increased diversity would be indicated by a greater range of ethnic origins, not just greater numbers of the usual minorities. Eltham's population may be more ethnically diverse, but to verify the claim we'd need to show a breakdown of the categories black, Asian and white and compare that with other regions.

By the way, why is "Black" capitalised while "white", used in the same context, isn't?

Under "Culture and identity" we read that "Its relatively national-average racial and ethnic makeup..." - doesn't this contradict the claim under "Migration and Ethnicity" that black and Asian origin is disproportionately high? IMO the sentence would stand without including the words "relatively national-average" which are in any case subjective.

-- Timberframe (talk)

Maps and illustrations[edit]

I have added a map of Eltham from OpenStreetMap with some details highlighted or added to relate to the text. I am proposing to add three groups of photos to illustrate

  • Parks and open spaces
  • Domestic architecture
  • The Highstreet and its environment

PeterEltham (talk) 09:01, 22 September 2014 (UTC) Proposed as belowPeterEltham (talk) 13:31, 22 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]


Parks and open spaces

  • King John's Walk (Green Chain Walk)
    King John's Walk (Green Chain Walk)
  • Butterfly Lane (Green Chain Walk)
    Butterfly Lane (Green Chain Walk)
  • Avery Hill Park and the Winter Gardens
    Avery Hill Park and the Winter Gardens
  • Oxlees meadows (Green Chain Walk)
    Oxlees meadows (Green Chain Walk)
  • Well Hall Pleasaunce - woodland garden
    Well Hall Pleasaunce - woodland garden
  • Well Hall Pleasaunce - Tudor Barn
    Well Hall Pleasaunce - Tudor Barn

Domestic Architecture

  • The Lord Chancellor's Lodging. c1420
    The Lord Chancellor's Lodging. c1420
  • "Corbett Houses" Eltham Park c1905
    "Corbett Houses" Eltham Park c1905
  • "Corbett Houses" Well Hall c 1905
    "Corbett Houses" Well Hall c 1905
  • Progress Estate. Built 1915
    Progress Estate. Built 1915
  • Semi-detached houses. Built 1938
    Semi-detached houses. Built 1938
  • Former local authority houses c 1955
    Former local authority houses c 1955

Highstreet and environs

  • Eltham bus and train stations built 1986
    Eltham bus and train stations built 1986
  • St. Johns CofE church
    St. Johns CofE church
  • Bob Hope Theatre
    Bob Hope Theatre
  • Old Greyhound Inn
    Old Greyhound Inn
  • Sunday market and the Eltham town sign
    Sunday market and the Eltham town sign
  • Shops in the ground floor of 18th century houses
    Shops in the ground floor of 18th century houses
  • Eltham C0fE School. founded 1814
    Eltham C0fE School. founded 1814
  • St. Mary's Community Centre
    St. Mary's Community Centre
  • Eltham Library
    Eltham Library
  • Christ Church (RC) and Priory
    Christ Church (RC) and Priory

PeterEltham (talk) 13:30, 22 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

22-23 Sept. Photo galleries added + map of greenchain walks. Some references and external links added. Material moved between sections to better comform to the section headings .PeterEltham (talk) 11:37, 23 September 2014 (UTC)[reply]

Population[edit]

The population of Eltham is given as 88,000. For what year is this an estimate? Where does the figure come from? --Oldontarian (talk) 12:51, 23 May 2015 (UTC)[reply]

External links modified[edit]

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External links modified[edit]

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Sunset town and Independent reference[edit]

IP editor User:176.57.253.190 has twice deleted a paragraph that is reliably sourced, first time suggesting it was "tendentious" (which I understand means "expressing or intending to promote a particular cause or point of view, especially a controversial one", and second time because "source article is not really about Eltham and comes from a disreputable newspaper". I have twice reverted the change, reflecting, first, WP:nPOV that articles should represent "fairly, proportionately, and, as far as possible, without editorial bias, all the significant views that have been published by reliable sources on a topic," and second, that The Independent in 1999 was a highly regarded UK broadsheet newspaper (definitely not "disreputable"). I am conscious of the WP:3RR, and have taken this issue to Talk so that it might be properly discussed without edit warring. Paul W (talk) 21:13, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]

The Independent, like its soulmate the Guardian, has a long and sordid record of sending reporters from Islington to write ignorant stories about Eltham to fill up space.
@https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/spate-of-racist-stabbings-in-eltham-had-gone-unpunished-6284643.html
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/two-decades-have-passed-but-the-hate-goes-on-in-eltham-6285108.html
https://www.independent.co.uk/news/the-lawrence-report-eltham-scene-of-the-crime-streets-where-race-hatred-is-the-norm-1073046.html
I think therefore tendentious is the right word here. The writer of the piece cited as the source in the article doesn't seem to have bothered to visit Eltham and has cynically brought it in to beef up his piece from America — Preceding unsigned comment added by 176.57.253.190 (talk) 21:46, 6 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
This is the first I have heard about the Islington elite's nefarious conspiracy against (checks notes) Eltham. This is almost certainly because this conspiracy exists only in your mind and has no basis in reality. There is no reason to believe that multiple reliable news sources have taken up a grudge against this particular London suburb rather than merely reporting on it. If you have a problem with The Independent then you can take that up with them. Please do not waste our time here and please do not remove validly sourced content from the article again. --DanielRigal (talk) 00:49, 7 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks for your intervention, User:DanielRigal. Paul W (talk) 11:06, 7 August 2022 (UTC)[reply]
IP editor User:176.57.253.190 has once again sought to delete reliably sourced content from the article. It has been reinstated. Paul W (talk) 09:02, 17 October 2022 (UTC)[reply]
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